Friday June 26, 2009

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secretariat7	Friday June 26, 2009	Lead	[-]
Posts: 1385 (Jun 26, 2009 5:41 AM) Ornery Bucker More My Recent Posts	Tags : None Imagine Croweland to be beet free...and it will be so... Getting us started this am, this piece sums up much of my feelings about Michael Jackson: Thoughts about Michael Jackson So, are they through filming on the beach? I mean, Robin has rescued the girl, so what else is there to do? "The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you." - David Foster Wallace
BarbieCat		#1	[-]
Posts: 11485 (Jun 26, 2009 6:53 AM) Nancy Drew Redux More My Recent Posts	Morning.. Sullivan's analysis of Jackson is interesting, but I think he's making some assumptions that are not necessarily valid. While Jackson certainly had an odd upbringing as a performer, to say he was enslaved by his family is extreme and ignores his own culpability and nature. A young person who lacks the will to perform, won't. How can anyone be so sure that not having a normal childhood explains everything about what he became? There a millions of kids who don't have a so-called "normal" childhood of play and school and parental involvement ... including his own siblings .... yet very few spend their adult lives in childish pursuits as he did. I suppose what I'm suggesting is that Michael was always "different" and while it's what made him a superstar, it also may have been a determining factor in his later life choices. The always fascinating nature versus nurture issues could be explored, but I'm disinclined to be as certain as Sullivan that it was mainly faulty nurturing that led to a troubled future... instead of his behavior being at result of his nature. The two probably go hand in hand, with one influence being stronger in some than others. Many people experience fame without becoming emotional cripples. By all accounts, he was intelligent and capable of rational direction [careerwise at least]. His weirdness.... trying to blur the lines of race, gender and age that shape most of us seems to come more from an innate narcissism. As his fame grew, he indulged himself over and over, without regard to normal restraints. On top of that... over the past 10 years or so he has been reported to have become dependent on prescription meds for a variety of ills, which could have caused lapses in judgement too. There are already hints that Jackson's heart failure may have been the result of an overdose, but of course, the medical examiner will be testing and no assumptions should be made. He could have been stressed out about his upcoming London performances. Fame can be a bitch, particularly if one is psychologically fragile or inclined to self destructive behavior. "Either you "get" him, or you don't" Last Edited By: BarbieCat Jun 26, 2009 6:57 AM. Edited 1 times.
Ruseabisquit		#2	[-]
Posts: 113 (Jun 26, 2009 6:58 AM) The Real Deal More My Recent Posts	BC I agree with your post. Michael was a very talented tortured soul.
secretariat7	More	#3	[-]
Posts: 1386 (Jun 26, 2009 8:25 AM) Ornery Bucker More My Recent Posts	Looks like Russell's stunt double did get to ride Rusty at least long enough to get a picture. From Murph's from yesterday: Stunt double I don't know, Barbie Cat, Sullivan doesn't absolve Jackson of anything. He ultimately bears responsibility for his own actions as an adult. However, if the allegations of how Jackson was treated as a boy are true, I can't think of a single other person to compare him with. How many children are treated like this AND become such megastars at such a young age? The Jackson Five was performing professionally in '67 or '68 when Michael was 9 or 10, and they were number one on the charts by the time he was 11 or 12. His brothers were older, much less famous, and weren't identified as "the talented one." Yeah, he was a weird dude, but show me somebody who had this type of experience and turned out normal. Edited to fix link. "The truth will set you free, but not until it is finished with you." - David Foster Wallace Last Edited By: secretariat7 Jun 26, 2009 8:29 AM. Edited 1 times.
Cindy4764		#4	[-]
Posts: 4399 (Jun 26, 2009 8:55 AM) Pic Slut More My Recent Posts	Probably both are true to some extent, he was a tortured soul and he was exploited by his family and our culture's treatment of extreme fame. I think Jackson was a deeply troubled man but I do think some of it was due to his environment and that he'd probably been exploited by this family from a young age. He also isn't the only Jackson child who has had a somewhat troubled life so some of it had to be caused by environment, IMO. In some ways you could say the same about Elvis, who we've read was rather troubled before he became famous but who most believe to have become exploited by Col Parker and others throughout his career. In any case, both very sad deaths at a much too young age. Well, the stunt double at least got to sit on Rusty for awhile, lol. I wonder if he got to film some actual scenes. "He sees everything through the point of view of the character. That's fantastic. It's like working with a proper actor as opposed to working with a movie star." - Kevin Macdonald Last Edited By: Cindy4764 Jun 26, 2009 8:58 AM. Edited 2 times.
babzee		#5	[-]
Posts: 2343 (Jun 26, 2009 9:04 AM) Just Me More My Recent Posts	Thanks for the link, Sec. I grieve for him; but I also grieve for the culture that created and destroyed him. That culture is ours' and it is a lethal and brutal one: with fame and celebrity as its core values, with money as its sole motive, it chewed this child up and spat him out. I hope he has the peace now he never had in his life. And I pray that such genius will not be so abused again.
Calrabbitfkyuku		#6	[-]
Posts: 631 (Jun 26, 2009 10:52 AM) More My Recent Posts	And I thought I was the only person who didn't like beets! I didn't even like them in a soup that Mr. Rabbit's mother used to make. I would eat it out of politeness, but I remember Mr. Rabbit one time kept saying to me, "Isn't this soup great?" I kept kicking him under the table to make him stop so she wouldn't give me some more, but he didn't get the hint. I don't even know what to say about Michael Jackson, except to express sadness about what happened to him and about his passing. I was watching yesterday some videos of his from the late 80's and was shocked to see how normal he looked. He had become so bizarre that I had forgotten how amazingly talented he was. I think that it would take a pretty solid person to deal with celebrity these days, especially when there are so many elements in the society who profit from tearing people down. (I am looking at you, Page "We know how to destroy people" Six.) I think Russell summed it up well in The Photograph Kills, "They will feed while you lie bleeding on the ground." "You can set fire to an actor's grandmother, but if you give him good notices, he'll figure out a way to regard the unfortunate grandma incident as an isolated lapse in judgment from an otherwise benevolent, discerning individual." Mick LaSalle
Cindy4764		#7	[-]
Posts: 4400 (Jun 26, 2009 10:53 AM) Pic Slut More My Recent Posts	maria found this article about filming in Wales being extended a few days, maybe to make up for those days they lost due to weather. RH gets a 3 days extension http://www.westerntelegraph.co.uk/news/4462051.Crowe_crew_to_finish_filming_next_Friday/ Sir Ridley Scott's Robin Hood epic gets filming extension 4:43pm Friday 26th June 2009 Film crews will spend more time in Pembrokeshire to complete scenes for Sir Ridley Scott's Robin Hood epic. The road closure at Freshwater West where Russell Crowe, Cate Blanchett and a host of local extras are currently filming battle and village scenes, has been extended by three days. The original road closure was due to end on Tuesday, (30th June) but the Welsh Assembly Government has agreed to it being extended until Friday, 3rd July, to allow location filming of the Holywood blockbuster to be completed. In the meantime, no new RH photos but I found these looking around the other day and thought they were really cute. He met Angelo at the Boxing Hall of Fame Induction in June 2005. For the pic hunters out there, I found these at http://pa.photoshelter.com/search?I_DSC=russell+crowe&_ACT=search&I_DSC_AND=t which is what came up when I clicked on Capital Pictures the other day. There are 1938 photos there (but many are from the Crow Indian Nation, lol - beautiful photos, though). I didn't go through photo by photo but I did look at the 25 pages and found these new ones as well as a few nice thumbnails from Kilkee and a few nice ones from Australia Day that we may or may not have seen. "He sees everything through the point of view of the character. That's fantastic. It's like working with a proper actor as opposed to working with a movie star." - Kevin Macdonald Last Edited By: Cindy4764 Jun 26, 2009 11:12 AM. Edited 1 times.
BarbieCat		#8	[-]
Posts: 11486 (Jun 26, 2009 11:00 AM) Nancy Drew Redux More My Recent Posts	Nice photos, cindy... a good find ------------- The latest on Jackson, from the AP via Yahoo news. Michael Jackson's death and from ABC, a story about the custody issues and persons seeking to raise the kids Custody of Michael's kids "Either you "get" him, or you don't" Last Edited By: BarbieCat Jun 26, 2009 11:08 AM. Edited 1 times.
TXKittie		#9	[-]
Posts: 4062 (Jun 26, 2009 11:05 AM) ezOp More My Recent Posts	Sec, thanks for the link to the article. I think he is spot on. I was never a fan of the Jackson 5 music or of MJ as a solo artist. What I have read about him over the years from insiders in the music industry corroborates Sullivan's comments. Some of the stuff I've read about his family during his formative years ... yowzah. MJ quite probably was a fragile person, so regardless of his childhood situation, he would have had difficulties facing the oftentimes harshness of life. Add all the additional stuff -- and his level of fame is way way beyond what most other celebs have faced -- to the equation, and it just doesn't present a pretty picture. Like Sec pointed out, I'm not absolving MJ of his actions as an adult. MJ is definately someone I would classify as weird. The tabloid media is going to have a feeding frenzy over his death, causes, reasons, finger pointing, and certainly going forward his children. It's going to be massively ugly. "They will feed while you lie bleeding on the ground." No shit. And the public is going to lap it up. Rogues are preferable to imbeciles because they sometimes take a rest. Alexandre Dumas
ecdent		#10	[-]
Posts: 74 (Jun 26, 2009 11:34 AM) More My Recent Posts	Hi! I'm still in shock. I used to have on of those Thriller jackets as a kid and wore it to school everyday. Does anybody else remember the Russell story about Michael Jackson that I mentioned last night? I'm beginning to think that I may have made it up.
Roheryn		#11	[-]
Posts: 778 (Jun 26, 2009 11:50 AM) More My Recent Posts	Yes, I remember the story, ecdent, don't worry ! I'm sorry to hear of MJ's death, but I'm not remotely surprised. He was a train wreck waiting to happen. Too bad no one who actually cared about him didn't kidnap him to a cabin in Alaska for six months and detox him. I wasn't particularly a fan of his music or dancing (I don't find groin-clutching a very tasteful move) but I admired his energy. Now all the self-justifying parasites, like Al Sharpton, will emerge, go on talk shows, write books and tell us all how they "loved" him. Ugh. "Man, if you've gotta ask, you'll never know "
ecdent		#12	[-]
Posts: 75 (Jun 26, 2009 12:12 PM) More My Recent Posts	On Larry King's show last night, he had Al Sharpton on as a guest. I normally don't like him, but I think he made a meaningful point. He mentioned all the celebrities who claimed to be Michael's friends releasing statements of condolence after his death. He said, "Where were you for him while he was still alive?" He discussed how a lot of his celebrity friends abandoned him after the molestation allegations, and that it broke his heart and spirit. He said that his heart was broken long before it stopped today. Last Edited By: ecdent Jun 26, 2009 12:15 PM. Edited 1 times.
virginiamanis		#13	[-]
Posts: 846 (Jun 26, 2009 12:29 PM) More My Recent Posts	Hello to everybody! Cindy, what nice pics! I am really impressed about Michael Jackson´s death, which has surprised me,really. Maybe he was ill or whatever but I didn´t imagine that he would die now.I danced and danced with his music, especially with "Thriller", which is a terrific song. I think that, independently on what may have happened in his personal life ( and it seems that he was really weird ), he was and is and will always be a great and important artist in the history of music, someone who created something new.When I see fans cry for him, I feel sad for them, too.Equina, I read your thoughts. I am listening right now to the emergency tapes on CNN Int. I am very sorry for Farrah, she must have fought a very brave battle but unfortunately she lost it. May she rest in peace! " If you don´t know who you are, if you require people to validate you, this job is going to kill you." RC Last Edited By: virginiamanis Jun 26, 2009 12:32 PM. Edited 1 times.
BarbieCat		#14	[-]
Posts: 11487 (Jun 26, 2009 12:44 PM) Nancy Drew Redux More My Recent Posts	Jackson withdrew and headed overseas after his trial.... it would have been pretty difficult for anyone to maintain a friendship with him with all the minders and "gatekeepers" keeping friends at bay ... I don't think Jackson was so much abandoned as the one who fled and closed himself off. His behavior became more and more odd... he let down a lot of people, making promises he didn't fulfill, making serial financial deals he repeatedly broke. Sharpton is a self serving spotlight junky who can never resist a microphone. If you'd like to read a story about him... Spoiler [+] He's tried to interject himself into some local Florida incidents [tho he doesn't live here] despite being completely ignorant of the issues and people involved. There was one instance this past year in which he flew down and called press conferences to protest the arrest of some black youths ... carrying on and on about the injustice... but [black] locals in the know boo'ed him down because these so called innocent youths had been terrorizing the housing development for a couple years and this time were caught after being identified by locals as the rapists of 3 women, killers of one. He was defending the thugs in front of the cameras as being victims of racist cops. Nothing could have been further from the truth. He soon slunk out of town, leaving a trail of slime in his wake. There's little evidence that Sharpton was a close confident of Jackson, except perhaps in his own mind and for his own PR, just like others are doing. Oh yes, a lot of people are going to try and capitalize on Jackson's death, Sharpton is right about that much, as he's doing it himself. "Either you "get" him, or you don't"
Roheryn		#15	[-]
Posts: 779 (Jun 26, 2009 1:26 PM) More My Recent Posts	I saw Sharpton on CNN before the Larry King show . He was in front of the Apollo Theatre (isn't that where the AG premiere was held ??) and I just thought he was a camera-loving opportunistic creep. "Man, if you've gotta ask, you'll never know "
BarbieCat		#16	[-]
Posts: 11488 (Jun 26, 2009 1:59 PM) Nancy Drew Redux More My Recent Posts	At Murph's... And we have a Friar Tuck !!! also, Robert Pugh was, of course, Master Allen in Master and Commander. Mark Addy was in that terrific film, The Full Monty. More cast for Robin Hood: Sir Godfrey - Mark Strong Eleanor - Eileen Atkins Friar Tuck - Mark Addy Sheriff of Nottingham - Matthew MacFadyen Baron Baldwin - Robert Pugh Baron Fitzrober- Gerard McSorley Thomas Longstride - Mark Llewelyn-Jones "Either you "get" him, or you don't"
ecdent		#17	[-]
Posts: 76 (Jun 26, 2009 2:37 PM) More My Recent Posts	I have never liked Al Sharpton; I always thought that he was an opportunist attention seeker, but that story you told, Barbie, is just aweful! He's worse than I thought. I feel sleazy for even quoting him! My favorite Mark Addy performance is with Heath Ledger in A Knight's Tale. He also did that series with Jami Gertz, Still Standing , which ran for several seasons and is on syndication of Lifetime. He does a really good American accent. My mom didn't believe me when I told her he was British.
Karencrowes		#18	[-]
Posts: 570 (Jun 26, 2009 3:53 PM) Can't Lick Our Russ! More My Recent Posts	Afternoon, I think it took Al Sharpton all of 3 seconds after Michael's death the position himself in front of the Apollo Theater and pontificate. I don't recall him as being the "king of pop's" bosom buddy. Where was he when the star was alive?? I was never much of a fan and after the child abuse episodes, he just disgusted me. If I felt anything for him it was pity. And that's all I have to say about that. I like borsht. Your Signature ... "Do the best job you can seeing the truth, and then do the best job you can telling the truth. Risk whatever you have to risk, because ultimately, it's probably not going to be as much as you think it is. Even if it is, at least you will have collapsed, been fired, shot at, or whatever for good reason rather than something stupid or self-serving." -- Keith Olbermann GOBAMA!!
sweptaway123		#19	[-]
Posts: 2871 (Jun 26, 2009 3:58 PM) The Real Deal More My Recent Posts	And we have a Friar Tuck !!! from Murphs. Words from the man. Poor man didn't even get to sit on Rusty but Sebastion is mighty fine too. From Russell: In the picture of the riding double Alesh Kosnar,(Stuart Clark is my stunt double) he is mounted on a horse called Sebastien, not Rusty. RC
ZhoraFRG		#20	[-]
Posts: 1690 (Jun 26, 2009 4:00 PM) You don't know Roland Bozz More My Recent Posts	I like borsht. You like borsht, I like bigos (sp). I liked MJ's music well enough, but I was never a fan. He was always too weird for my liking. And for years now he just looked freakish. If anything, I pitied him. He obviously could hardly cope with himself, let alone this outlandish level of fame. Hence I'm not exactly shocked about his death. I feel sorry for everyone close to him, though. And for his fans. Last Edited By: ZhoraFRG Jun 26, 2009 4:03 PM. Edited 1 times.

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Friday June 26, 2009

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